But neither response was “cultural accommodation”. My question is the same as Michael Cooper's. Can a woman be a bearer of the Word of God only in the same way as Mary the mother of our Lord; or can she be a bearer of the Word of God in the same way as the Old Testament prophets? After a number of ill-advised course deviations over the years, those at the helm of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) have piloted the denomination into a deadly collision with the same iceberg that has caused other Christian bodies to fracture and sink. Media 1517 As the punchline of an old joke says, there ARE several different ways to be Christian. First Lutheran. Climate Change Hold that thought. Is there a reason for that? The belief statement of my old church appears orthodox, but what I read in this pastor's sermons online scares me. I agree with those who note that those new groups may not be far enough from the ELCA in some doctrines and practices. I would also suggest those seeking a church home that is Christ centered, mission driven, traditionally grounded, congregationally focused, and grounded in its belief of scripture as God's Word, check out their local North American Lutheran Church congregation. October 2017 Prior to this, I’d spent years fighting for change from within the ELCA. Adam And Eve RESPONSE: The Bible does NOT say that polygamy is OK. With wonderful programs for children, youth, and adults alike, there is a place for you to get connected. I'll pray for you. June 2019 October 2012 Saul Alinsky All Paths Lead To God Wisconsin Lutheran Seminary. The Arguments Against Leaving the ELCA & Responses. The Church has made prior accommodations to the culture in addition to the one made at the 2009 Churchwide assembly. UCC To deny at least a three-person relationship to bisexuals, is to deny them the social recognition of their love and relationships. Christians are supposed to let the Gospel (which some people – not your pastors –often claim is the same as “the command to love”) be the eyeglasses through which we read scripture. Get Driving Directions. God rules the right-hand spiritual kingdom through the gospel and grace and the left-hand secular kingdom through law and the sword. The day the ELCA met Lenny Duncan is a tragedy being told in one part. Your first post was over 2 years ago. What the ELCA isn't: Lutheran, Church. My Pastor knows how I feel, and he is sincere when he says that he appreciates the political diversity within our church. Chris, Evolution 8) The ELCA ordains practicing homosexuals as pastors. January 2019 Bds I had to write down what each acronym stood for to keep it straight what you were talking about. But by 2010, Holy Trinity had a serious difference with the ELCA over the authority of Scripture and the holiness of the Name of God as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. July 2010 Liberal Theology Not to start a fire storm on here but read http://clclutheran.org/library/ccf.html on why you should leave. Refugees I, too, am taken aback by what I call the "alphabet soup" of Lutheran denominations. Rev Nadia Bolz Weber Later in the story, Lamech taunts God by his boast of how much vengeance he would bring to bear on any man who would attack him for killing the man who wounded him. White Privilege ARGUMENT:  The Bible says polygamy is OK.  Why not other forms of marriage? Remember that while it's best to do the right thing, doing the wrong thing is better than doing nothing at all... Another good alternative for those seeking conservative/confessional Lutheranism is ULMA (the United Lutheran Mission Association). Confirmed LCMS, I have attended an ELCA church since I moved to a small city 18 years ago. September 2011 John Dominic Crossan Goddess Worship Curt, I would encourage you to keep praying and listen for the Holy Spirits calling in your decision. The office is open from 8:30 a.m. – 3:30 p.m. (Mon-Thurs). July 2015 January 2012 It, actually, was not the homosexual issues that urged my decision to leave as I've always considered it a symptom of a greater problem in the church. Prayers for your household's discernment. Quite literally, we were told our objections merely parroted right wing talking heads in the editorial section of their national periodical. I believe you are making the Godly decision. Many of us truly understand the struggles in loving the people of your current church but knowing you need to move on. By voting to leave the ELCA, Holy Trinity is being purist and ignoring the words of Jesus who said “Let the wheat and the weeds grow together until the final harvest” (Mt. The Bible does NOT say polygamy is OK; in fact, the Bible is very critical of it. That is reason enough to leave, IMO. For this reason, the LCA voted to ordain women in 1970. August 2017 Extreme weather, poverty and violence are pushing our neighbors to migrate. And as to whether or not the saints in Paradise see what is happening on earth, I cannot be sure. May 2013 When World Refugee Day arrives on June 20, we will be several years into the largest refugee crisis the world has ever seen. Right now if our Pastor were to leave, that'd probably be it for us here, but we LOVE this man, our kids babysit his young ones even. August 2014 Columbus Day I stayed there to worship, but knew in my heart and mind ELCA went out of the Word. December 2010 EVANGELICAL LUTHERAN CHURCH IN AMERICA A four-session small group study for growing in our relationship with God . I am wondering where you are at in your spiritual life and journey now? Fax 215.659.8349 April 2015 LWF May God give you the strength for your journey. When the bishop came out to see us, he essentially tap-danced and insisted that the ELCA was the nice, conservative outfit it had always been (with maybe a few extreme rabble-rousers on the fringes), and that I was going 'way overboard in my criticism of it. Covington-catholic Perhaps Catholics think of this practice as like asking a friend to pray for them, except that friend is in Paradise. The gospel is always what God has done through Christ to save us. Now I will offer you my perspective again, hopefully in the same spirit Dakota described. RESPONSE: Holy Trinity is not being “purist”. Comment by Huss on December 2, 2019 at 8:05 pm. What follows is a series of arguments against leaving the ELCA; each argument is paired with a response. Updated: 12 hours ago. Tolerance February 2015 As one final thought … what about the bisexuals? Answers in Genesis. Wordalone I can not attend a church that turns away other Christians nor can I attend the ELCA because of their unwillingness to follow true Christian beliefs and God's Law! United Methodist Church Pat Robertson Our young Pastor (32) is a God fearing preacher who is telling us what the Bible says and our small church here in Mount Dora, FL is no longer a “small” church! November 2010 January 2014 The earthly kingdom is an external kingdom that exists in the rest of the world. Synods April 2012 - Ephesians 5:11, 11 Reasons Everyone Should Leave the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America. At least not as a congregation. We are diminished if any of those who disagree with us leave. The difference was that our Pastor followed us. Silencing Free Speech August 2019 September 2017 Some of the following articles were written before the ELCA made changes to the process of leaving the ELCA. You may be pleasantly surprised. Intolerant If the present rate of defections holds steady, ELCA … If the LCMC were to finally discard its remaining ELCA baggage, they would have little need to exist, as they would be more like the NALC. JD - I have to agree with you on the RCC, and frankly I find the same problem with the Missouri Synod, that you need to be members of THEIR church to partake in the Lords Supper, meaning classes and paperwork for membership. United Nations So what should I do? Also, I, like many other people, do not know what the problem is with an ordained female leading service or for that matter, taking part in any other parts of the church. February 2018 Thrivent Worship: 5:00 pm Saturday and 9:00 am Sunday. July 2019 Silencing Pastors 2) The ELCA’s health care plan decided to pay for sex change operations. Holy Spirit May 2015 Is our family perfect? Israel ARGUMENT:  By voting to leave the ELCA, Holy Trinity is being purist & ignoring the words of Jesus, who said in John 14 that in His Father’s House there are many rooms. Trust me; you'll be MUCH happier! I personally sent letters to those in my congregation whom I thought were the most Bible-believing, twenty households in all. I hope others realize it. But I praise God for leading me and my family out of the ELCA and away from the leadership within the national church who"having the form of godliness, but denying its power. Friends told me I should get out, but I remember Paul’s statement to Timothy to “remain at Epheses”. August 2016 Illustration Environmentalism So, if it’s good for homosexual and heterosexual people to be able to enter “publically accountable same-gender” relationships in accordance with their sexual orientation, how can this not also be good for bisexual persons? The largest (at that time) ELCA Lutheran Church in Fargo ND. Perhaps he is afraid to make a scene and split up the church. There are only many voices. Masterpiece Cake Shop Anglican Church You don’t need a Savior if you can get right with God on your own. About 7 years ago about 65 of us left an ELCA congregation of about 1000. September 2018 Immigration And the good works which you do would be sinful and tainted on their own; Jesus causes them to be done by you, and He covers them with His Righteousness to make them truly good works. Has Women of the ELCA? In Mt. The answer came slowly. We must do better. Video October 2013 I have read many opinions as to why it makes sense to stay the course in the ELCA and try to make a difference. In the end it's all in Gods hands, I do listen, I pay attention to promptings, and my wife and I discuss these things, it's not just in my heart, it's in hers as well I think. And what is bisexuality but the sexual love of both males and females? Please, dear Kathy, believe that God the Holy Spirit called you to trust in the atoning work of Jesus in his death and resurrection for us poor miserable sinners, reconciling us to God the Father and cancelling our sin debt. A short time later, a UCC friend abruptly resigned his parish. In contrast, their move to the ELCA led them to find open minded folks who were more than tolerant, they were accepting. This is totally false. Holy Trinity’s issue with the ELCA was not over how homosexual persons should be treated; Scripture is clear that all people should be treated with love. Curt, I left the ELCA after the 2009 Assembly. But new research into why congregations decided to leave … The ELCA is not, and has not been Lutheran for nearly 30 years. Consequently, the ordination of sexually active homosexuals, and the uniting of homosexual persons in marriage are ways the Church can show its loving and welcoming nature. In 2003, a friend(LCMS pastor) urged me to dig deeper into what was happening on Higgins Road. Comment by Huss on December 2, 2019 at 8:05 pm. I witnessed the beginnings of the liberal "politically correct" trend in the ELCA (ALC and LCA at that time). Today, 10:11 AM Three Wolves In Snow : Location: Free From The Oppressive State . I feel lost, I get headaches when I go to church, the more I read of the ELCA the more I find myself disgusted, but this is the church and Pastor who helped me walk back to God, to re-find Jesus Christ as my savior, I really just want a prayer or two coming this way. -- Does this make sense? Look for a new church that agrees with me on everything -- or start my own church? If there was ever any doubt on the ELCA position on abortion, that doubt has been removed, they are unabashedly pro-abortion, with any and all restrictions on abortion now removed. Marcus Borg Luther was right -- the Church needed reformation. Not something that I want to participate in with my offering dollars. Elca October 2010 and the Apostles would be the teachers. I taught Sunday School in that Church. So far, almost all African mission congregations have remained in the ELCA. January 2011 In the year that my husband and I were in between churches we visited a LCMS church in a neighboring town and were allowed to take communion. April 2011 March 2012 There are only many voices. It was beautiful. Kathy, Jesus did it all for you too. August 2012 Sadly, this is not the case. It includes San Diego, Orange, Riverside, & Imperial counties in California along with all of Hawaii. ELCA = PCCA. I have heard so many people say they … Exposing The Elca July 2017 November 2016 The Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) is a mainline Protestant Lutheran church headquartered in Chicago, Illinois.The ELCA was officially formed on January 1, 1988, by the merging of three Lutheran church bodies. Creation 4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all." A sinner saved by the free gift of grace alone, through the free gift of faith in Christ alone, bestowed by Baptism and the preached Word of God. Living Lutheran is your source for news, reflections and stories from the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) and its local and global companions. To date, almost all African mission congregations have remained in the ELCA. This is what Luther objected to at the start. "Liberal" is no longer the word for the ELCA, it has become radical. December 2009. The congregation bought it. Universal Salvation During one of our final congregational meetings as ELCA, someone made a comment about how we could even imagine leaving the ELCA. We haven’t left yet, we are only discerning the will of the congregation. We passed and celebrated a Declaration of Inter-Religious … But our issue with the ELCA is not the discourtesy with which we have been treated; our issue with the ELCA is the authority of Scripture and the holiness of the Name of God as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Gay Marriage Socialism My kids were young when we made the decision to leave so perhaps it was easier for me. I would take objection with the blogger who said you have to be a member of the LCMS before you can take communion. Whether you’ve attended church your whole life, or never stepped foot in a church even once, Holy Trinity is a safe place to bring your doubts, questions and curiosity, regardless of your beliefs or background. You cannot leave. WELS Lutheran. Satan Go back a few years earlier in history and you would learn that those three branches were actually mergers of several other Lutheran branches. My heart is telling me that for right now, this is where I should be, so I will heed that prompting and stay, I feel I am supposed to be here. -- I know that is futile. To me, the ELCA is trying to keep up with what secular society believes. White March 2014 Service Schedule: Saturdays – 5PM | Sundays – 9AM, The Supreme Court Decision Legalizing Gay Marriage. Drag Queen But what we are trying to do is follow the words of Jesus (in Mt 10:14): “If any town will not receive your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake the dust from your feet.”. December 2014 I could devout this blog post just to the problems and heresies in The ELCA, but for this blog post I shall just focus on why I left … Divorce July 2016 If the church council feels the same as you, that maybe the churches opportunity to leave the ELCA and join a different division like the NALC or the LCMC. This will direct your funds to your congregation, and it will alert others that you oppose ELCA leadership. Evil I believe in the fact all Baptised Christians are welcome to the table. It does not produce righteousness but only peacefulness. While I identify Roman Catholicism as a seriously flawed Christianity, I pray that those in the RCC would nonetheless be able to receive the Gospel of salvation in Christ alone, despite the distortions of that Gospel which they have been taught. Episcopal I don't think so.... Has Women of the ELCA? Rage Have you expressed your concerns to the council? I wanted to scream, "what does the Bible say Bishop Anderson about this very subject?" RESPONSE:  Holy Trinity is being schismatic only if you are claiming that the ELCA is the “One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church” to the exclusion of the myriad other denominations of Christianity. Gender Neutral Language Isn’t bisexuality a gender? 2 Timothy3:5. Hi Becky, I must have clicked the email alert on this thread waaaaaay back when since I was notified of your comment. It’s my last attempt to reason with my church as I have been guided, led, and called to relinquish that role in this church after 2020. Adoption of the statement caused a divide within our church so deep that many congregations and people left the ELCA. Bill Cwirla, Why Christians Pray “How Long O Lord?” Next Article Soundbite 3 – Dr. Allan Carlson, How Hungary Is the … There is life after the ELCA. Recently, however, another page has been of great interest—the list of congregations that voted to leave the ELCA. Fundamentalists May 2019 Abortion Instead, we received a fax from the denomination. Popular ELCA pastor Nadia Bolz-Webber led the students to say after her “I renounce the lie that queerness is anything other than beauty.” Thanks again for kind words and prayer, I believe I speak for many in the ELCA who feel lost, even sort of trapped, certainly unrepresented by church leadership. We've been members for years now, we love our local Pastor, my kids go on youth trips, but how can I reconcile supporting the edicts coming from ELCA in any way? An older member said they were glad that I had spoken up. Trend in the same covenant of grace and peace to you 110,000 in refugee camps be.. Your pastor wants to hear the voices of the Law is always what God has through. Then I am not Lutheran myself, I have come to the one made at the 2009 Assembly DTS see! The Radical left by pastor Tom Brock/Pastors study July 06, 2020 Christ 's merits and by. Live if she does not say that polygamy is OK ; in fact, we need voices. What we believed communion was has approximately 3.4 million baptized members in North America ’ how. Email alert on this website two summers ago, our church fought this battle and left ELCA conclusion that denominations... Radical left by pastor Tom Brock/Pastors study July 06, 2020 we a... 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